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 Post subject: Re: The need for Faith
PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 1:33 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 1:45 pm
Posts: 2081
Location: Amarillo, TX
I know this is rather lengthy, but I hope it will be helpful to all of our faithful AV Bible Believers!

Pastor Steve Schwenke
Liberty Baptist Church
Amarillo, TX
Psalm 119:45 And I will walk at liberty: for I seek thy precepts.

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 Post subject: Re: The need for Faith
PostPosted: Sun Sep 02, 2012 4:08 pm 
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Location: Amarillo, TX
The Need for Faith Regarding the Preservation of Scripture

Romans 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

The Lord God Almighty has given us a Book by which we are to live. While there may be heated discussion about the mode of salvation in different eras of the Biblical narrative, one thing cannot be denied by any real Bible student, and that is the need for faith regarding what God said.
God may choose at His discretion to give us sound, credible evidence and support for our faith, but in the end, God expected faith from His people in Biblical times, and still expects faith from us today.
God never one time in Scripture, so far as I know, demanded a “blind-leap-in-the-dark” faith from anyone. Our faith in God’s word is predicated upon our knowledge of God’s working in our own lives, and in the world around us. The faith God expects from us is a reasonable faith. (Isa. 1:18, Rom. 12:1)
For instance, we can believe God when He says “God is love” based upon our understanding of John 3:16. God demonstrated and proved His love for us at Calvary.
The point of this essay is to demonstrate that at some point in time in the multitudes of debates and discussions over the Bible Versions and our beloved Authorized Version, faith must enter into the equation at some point in time.
We know what God said about inspiration:

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Ti 3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

But how did God go about this act of inspiration? Many theories abound, but man is mystified in the end, because so little is known of many of the actual events of the “original autographs.”
We know how God originally inspired the Mosaic Law (including Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy). God told Moses to write those books, and Moses wrote them. This would be classified as Direct Dictation.
But can we say the same thing about the book of Joshua?
Who wrote the book of Ruth?
Who wrote the books of I and II Chronicles?
Did those authors know at the time they were writing that they were being “inspired by God” to write the “original autographs” of Scripture?
I don’t think anyone could prove the above statement either way! Thus the need for FAITH in the written word of God, and the promise God made to us in II Timothy 3:16-17.
It is even doubtful if the Apostle Paul knew for any certainty that any of his epistles were divinely inspired “original autographs.” At one point, Paul gave us his OPINION on a subject, apparently not knowing that he was writing under the “inspiration of God!”

1 Corinthians 7:6 But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment.
1 Corinthians 7:10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband:

The Apostle Paul also encouraged the Colossian believers to read a letter that was not included in the canon of Scripture:

Colossians 4:16 And when this epistle hath been read among you, cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans; and that ye also read the epistle from Laodicea.

Clearly, Paul did not always know when or if he was under the “inspiration of God” when writing his epistles. Yet here they are, still preserved for us as God intended.
The point is clear. Not all authors of Scripture knew what they were writing would end up being Scripture. Thus it is impossible for us to nail down with any certainty the mechanics of each individual “original autograph.” We certainly have enough information to make some conclusions (Moses, Jeremiah, David, Isaiah, and others), but are these the rule, or are these special cases? The Bible makes its own statement on the question at hand:

Heb 1:1 ¶ God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
Heb 1:2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Ah Ha! Light from the Scripture! God is not bound by “scientific methods” of the world’s greatest intellects. God can do things differently at different times, if He so chooses. It is quite evident from even a brief survey of the Books of the Bible and their authors that God did in fact use different men and different methods when it came to the “original autographs” and thus each instance was unique.
The lesson to be learned here is two-fold. First, God will not be boxed in by any demands for “scientific methodology.” Secondly, while God will give us good solid reasons to believe what He said, He will ultimately demand faith in His word as the final step of obedience. Science, methodology, archaeology, linguistics, and all other “proofs” of God’s word will only carry us so far. In the end, we must believe what God said!
The same line of reasoning must be used in any discussion on the preservation of the text of Scripture. Inspiration and Preservation of Scripture are two doctrines tied together. We cannot discuss one without the other. They are inseparable.
The Critics of the Authorized Version demand an inordinate amount of “proof” that the KJV is in fact the perfectly preserved and inspired word of God. Yet they never stoop to exhibit any faith in the promises God made about His words Himself. They hesitate to believe the evidence contained in the Scriptures themselves regarding this issue.
When the Bible Believer goes to the Scripture to demonstrate that God Himself blessed, sanctioned, and even “inspired” many translations from Genesis to Revelation, the Critics are silent.
When the Bible Believer goes to the Scripture to demonstrate that the word “Scripture” is NEVER used as a description of the “divinely inspired original autographs,” the Critics are silent. The word “Scripture” as used in the Bible itself is ALWAYS a reference to the copies available at that time!
When the Bible Believer goes to the Scripture again to demonstrate that God has miraculously and perfectly preserved His words already in Bible times, again, the Critics are strangely silent.
However, the Critics are quick to demand “scientific proof.” They want to discuss manuscript evidence, and scientific methodology. They want to ask questions like, “Were the KJV translators inspired?”
The emphasis of this question is man-centered, intelligence-centered, and methodology-centered. It is NOT God-centered, nor is it faith centered! It has already been established that not all of the “original authors” knew when or if they were being “inspired.” Why would such a question be put forward as legitimate, when the question of inspiration has not yet been settled? This merely demonstrates a lack of faith in the written promises of God, and an acknowledgement that God will use whom He chooses, when He chooses, with or without their consent!
Let us examine carefully what the Bible says about the preservation of Scripture, and let us derive our conclusions and applications from Scripture.

Exhibit A
Exodus 32 gives us a vivid story of how quickly Israel departed from the verbal commandments given them at Mt. Sinai (see Ex. 20). Moses now has the “original autographs” in his hand when God tells him to go down to the base camp, and take care of Israel’s idolatry. What does Moses do with the “original autographs?”

Exodus 32:19 And it came to pass, as soon as he came nigh unto the camp, that he saw the calf and the dancing: and Moses’ anger waxed hot, and he cast the tables out of his hands, and brake them beneath the mount.

Gasp! Shudder! Horrors! The “original manuscripts” have been destroyed! What shall we ever do!
I can see the educated elitists of Moses’ day reprimanding him for being so careless with the “original manuscripts!”
But the Lord apparently did not think too much about the incident. Moses was not reproved for his actions. God never rebuked him for breaking the original tables of stone. God never made any statements about how we are to care for the “original manuscripts.” As stated previously, many of the authors of the “originals” did not even know they were writing “the originals!”
How was this incident resolved? Well, God did not tell any of the scholars in Moses’ day to carefully piece together the broken pieces of stone, and hope that they could “reconstruct” the “original text.” The Lord did not give instructions to the intellectual elite to carefully sift through the rocks and stones at the spot of Moses’ great transgression and hope that they would have enough rebuild the “original text.”
God did something that no scholar ever gave Him credit for, at least not in any practical manner. God PRESERVED the original text by re-writing it HIMSELF.

Exodus 34:1 And the LORD said unto Moses, Hew thee two tables of stone like unto the first: and I will write upon the tables the words that were on the first tables, which thou brakest.

You see, some of us in the AV camp realize something the scholars and critics don’t. The author of a book has complete control over that book. He can rewrite it at will. God is NOT the author of confusion, but of peace (I Cor. 14:33). The Scholars create confusion over a text that is perfectly plain. God wrote the Bible, God preserved the Bible. The words in the Bible are God’s words, not man’s words. The Lord God Almighty, Jesus Christ, the creator of Heaven and Earth, is perfectly capable of taking care of the words He wrote, despite the best (worst?) efforts of man and Satan to destroy them!
Moses broke the original tables of stone. God preserved those tables of stone by simply re-writing them!

Exhibit B
Jeremiah was given the difficult task of preaching condemnation and judgment to his own people. He saw first hand the destruction of his nation and the city of Jerusalem. Jeremiah records for us an interesting story of how God spoke to King Jehoiakim through the written word in Jeremiah 36. Jeremiah spoke the “originally inspired words” to Baruch the Scribe, who in turn put those words into writing (Jer. 36:1-4). Jeremiah then commands Baruch to take the scroll, go into the Temple, and read those words publicly. Baruch follows the command. (Jer. 36:5-10). The princes of the people hear Baruch, and take the scroll from him, and sent him packing (vs. 11-19). The princes then took the scroll and began to read it to Jehoiakim. While Jehudi was reading the scroll aloud, he began to cut it into pieces, until finally it was completely destroyed. To add insult to injury, he put each piece into the fire, until it was completely consumed (vs. 20-27).
As an aside, we can learn from this passage that the word of God is indeed “quick and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword.” The word of God brought such conviction and agony into the hearts and minds of Jehudi and Jehoiakim that they could not stand to even read it or hearken unto it. Instead of bringing them to repentance, it brought them to repugnance. They hated it, and destroyed it, just like the Pharisees and Saducees hated and crucified Jesus Christ.
But what shall we do now? The original manuscript that Baruch wrote at the hands of Jeremiah is now destroyed!
Gasp! Shudder! Horrors! Whatever shall we do???
No worries! The same God that gave Jeremiah the “original” resolves the problem for us! The last six verses of the same chapter reveals God’s method of preservation in this instance. The Lord reappears to Jeremiah, gives him instructions to rewrite the “original autograph,” which he does faithfully.
Problem resolved!
However, the Lord gives us this little nugget:

Jer. 36:32, “…and there were added besides unto them many like words.”

After all, these words were NOT Jeremiah’s, but the Lord’s! He gave the “original,” and when God preserved His own “originals” He added to them!

Exhibit C
We will remain in the book of Jeremiah. Chapters 50-51 give us a scalding judgment from the Lord upon Babylon. While God did use Babylon as a tool to bring judgment upon Israel, Israel is still God’s beloved people. Furthermore, while God was bringing judgment upon Israel for their departure for the word of God, God also gave Israel hope by promising judgment upon their captors, and a restoration of Israel to their own land. This judgment upon Babylon was put into writing. Jeremiah entrusted the “original manuscript” to a “quiet prince” by the name of Seraiah (Jer. 51:59). Jeremiah then instructed Seraiah to read this judgment in public at Babylon. When he was finished reading this scroll, he was to roll it up, tie a stone to it, and throw it into the River Euphrates as a picture of the coming destruction of Bablyon.
Yet somehow, we still have a copy of this judgment written for us in the text of Scripture! Somehow, God preserved his words for us today, despite the fact that the “original text” was tossed into the river Euphrates!
There are many plausible explanations for this, and it is quite obvious that there was more than one copy of this judgment. Yet the critics of the AV are so quick to point this out that they are also quick to overlook some important facts. The most important point they overlook is that God providentially and perfectly preserved HIS words after telling HIS prophet to throw HIS words into the river. Apparently, The Lord Himself does not think as highly of the “original autographs” as the scholars do!
There is no problem with the preservation of Scripture with God!
The word of God is just that – God’s words. He can do with them as He pleases. It is our duty to BELIEVE what He said, and live according to it. It is not our duty to “criticize” what God said, and look to “scientific methodology” support the claims of Scripture.

Exhibit D
Proverbs 25:1 These also are proverbs of Solomon, which the men of Hezekiah king of Judah copied out.

“Copied out?” What happened to the “original autographs?” The simple answer is that we do not know what happened to them. All we know is that in Hezekiah’s reign, the scribes in Hezekiah’s court came across some of Solomon’s proverbs, copied them, and that copy ended up as part of the “inspired text” of Scripture.
How does that fit with the doctrine of inspiration? Who was inspired? Solomon? And we know this how?
And then what happened to the “divinely inspired original autographs?” We don’t know! After all the hot air about how careful the Jewish Scribes were in copying scripture, and counting letters and spaces, and destroying any roll that had any kind of gloss or error in it, the scholars are suddenly silent when it comes to the implications and ramifications of this verse! The statement is clear: The originals were LOST and somebody had to copy them out for us!
Yet in all of this, we again see the divine intervention of the Lord Jesus Christ as He not only gives us the Scriptures for inspiration, He also sees fit to PRESERVE those same Scriptures for us, even when they are “lost” or missing.

We could continue on with several other examples, but I believe these four should be sufficient. The question before us is simple: Did God promise to preserve His words for us? The answer is an emphatic YES, even by the critics of the AV. We can argue over the mechanics of preservation, just as we can argue over the mechanics of inspiration. We can argue over family classifications of manuscripts. We can argue over the orthodoxy of particular individuals associated with copying, “correcting,” amending, etc. the Sacred Text (individuals such as Origen, Eusebius, Jerome, Augustine, etc.) We can argue over the history of the corrupt texts, the history of the Old Latin, the Latin Vulgate, the Textus Receptus, and all of the assorted translations that covered Europe prior to the printing of the Authorized Version. We could argue about the secrecy and heresy of Westcott and Hort, and their devious plot to destroy the Textus Receptus, and replace it with their own corrupt Greek New Testament. We could argue about the critical approach to translation, much of which is borrowed from Westcott and Hort. We could throw in arguments from Hills, Pickering, Burgon, Fuller, etc.
But all of this is merely a side issue to the real debate. The real debate is simple. Did God promise to preserve ALL of His words for us? If so, then where are those words? When the Scholars respond by saying that we can approach those words by carefully studying all of these manuscripts and attempting to reconstruct the “original autographs,” they have stepped out of Biblical grounds. God has already spoken on the issue, and demonstrated how HE would preserve HIS words for us!
In every single example of preservation given to us in Scripture by God Himself, no such language or ideas are even hinted at. God gave the “original,” God perfectly preserved every word of the “original” in each instance, and nobody had to guess at it, or “reconstruct the text,” or use any “family classification” scheme or other schemes to obtain the “original text.” God wrote it, God preserved it, and nobody questioned it.
The critics then ask us how we can leap to the conclusion that God preserved His words in the KJV, and not in their original language texts, or in any of the new versions. The answer is two fold.
First, Jesus Christ told us how to identify true prophets from false prophets:

Matthew 7:20 Therefore by their fruits ye shall know them.

The fruit of the KJV is so self-evident that it is hardly worth discussing here. But it is unquestionable. No other translation has lasted nearly as long, and still continued its usefulness in preaching, teaching, the salvation of souls, and the discipleship of Christians. It is still going strong after 400 years, and is still being used around the world as a reliable text of Scripture.
The fruit of the original language only position, and the modern version position is also self-evident. Confusion, laziness, pride, and selfishness infests all churches with the “Bible of your own choice” philosophy. It is “every man for himself, live as you please, and Don’t worry, be happy” philosophy.
Second, Jesus Christ demands that we live by FAITH, not by sight. He has given us ample evidence of His ability to not only inspire the original autographs, but also to perfectly preserve them from utter destruction. Sometimes this destruction came by the carelessness of His servants (i.e. Moses), the outrage of His enemies (Jehudi), and at least once by direct command from God Himself (Seraiah). However the loss of the “original manuscript” came about, it was God Himself who preserved it, and the preserved text was honored by God and man alike. Since God has repeatedly demonstrated His desire and ability to preserve His own text perfectly, His expectation of faith on this point is not some blind “leap in the dark.” It is a faith based upon fact. It is a faith based upon the written promises of God, and His previous demonstration to keep His promise!
At some point in time, the Child of God is called upon to stop depending upon his own scientific methodology, and start depending upon God’s words!

Romans 1:17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God by faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.

Pastor Steve Schwenke
Liberty Baptist Church
Amarillo, TX
Psalm 119:45 And I will walk at liberty: for I seek thy precepts.

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 Post subject: Re: The need for Faith
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 10:34 am 
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Excellent work; I like it brother.
And you're right; after all the dust settles, the real need is faith.

The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever." Psalms 12:6-7

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 Post subject: Re: The need for Faith
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 1:55 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 1:45 pm
Posts: 2081
Location: Amarillo, TX
Yep...but it is a reasonable faith based on precedent.
This was the message I preached last night...simple stuff like this really helps bolster our people's faith in the word of God. It is all scripture, and none of this "high-fallutin' mumbo jumbo" the scholars like to throw at us!

Pastor Steve Schwenke
Liberty Baptist Church
Amarillo, TX
Psalm 119:45 And I will walk at liberty: for I seek thy precepts.

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 Post subject: Re: The need for Faith
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:45 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2010 6:42 pm
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And it's not blind faith.
I've gone through a number of bibles; the KJB is the only one, where one can trust to contain every word which proceeds from the mouth of God.

1Peter 1:18,19
redeemed ... with the precious blood of Christ

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