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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2017 10:23 pm 
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Soldier4Christ wrote:
Concerning Paul in 1 Corinthians 15. He spoke on two points that Mormons argue is in their favor. Baptism for the dead, and three degrees of glory. Paul spoke in verse 29 about basically "Why are they baptizing for the dead if they don't believe in the resurrection?" The other thing is Paul speaking of a glory of the sun, moon, and stars.

The way I was taught -- this "baptism of the dead" had nothing to do with Christians. It was a pagan practice in the areas around Corinth. So Paul was saying even the pagans believe in some type of resurrection, else they wouldn't have bothered! So basically this Mormon practice = paganism.
Soldier4Christ wrote:
The other deal is that we know God's word is preserved. The Bible promises it in multiple places, Psalm 12:6-7, the words of Jesus "Heaven and earth shall pass away, my words shall not pass away," Isaiah 40:8, etc. So basically, you have to pick a side. Either parts of the Bible are unreliable or corrupted, and God was unable to preserve His words, and now you need to also believe the Book of Mormon... or Mormons don't believe the Bible and want to direct you to their Scriptures.

Right! They "use" the KJB in order to gain the trust of their targets, but in reality they do not believe it is inerrant -- in fact what the satanic Mormon cult doesn't like to tell you is that Joseph Smith claimed there were all types of errors in the Bible and he also claimed that God gave HIM the authority to correct "mistakes" in the KJB and so he set about to "restore" it resulting in his own version which he called the "Joseph Smith Translation." ( sound familiar? ) :roll:

Here is a comparison of the Holy Bible to Smith's corrupted garbage:

John 1:1 - KJV
"In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God."

John 1:1,4 - Joseph Smith Translation
"In the beginning was the gospel preached through the Son. And the gospel was the word, and the word was with the Son, and the Son was with God, and the Son was of God."

Not even close! :roll:

Source:
Joseph Smith's "Inspired" Revisions to the King James Bible
By Joel B. Groat
http://mit.irr.org/joseph-smiths-inspir ... _irr_end11

Soldier4Christ wrote:
Another thing I found similar to their beliefs to KJV Believer's is their view of the Plan of Salvation. Didn't we discuss we don't immediately goto heaven or hell? Well the Mormons too believe this. They believe we goto Paradise or hell (spirit prison). They also believe, as 1 Peter 3 says, Jesus ministered to those spirits in prison. Can you guys shed some light on this area also?

Ok I think maybe you were a little confused on what we were talking about there -- we believe paradise/Abraham's bosom was once used was a temporary holding place until the blood of Jesus was shed / applied, then he led captivity captive per EPH 4:8. But this is now no longer needed and today believers who die are in the presence of God per 2 COR 5:8. So that would not be the same at all. Of course there is some measure of truth in their lump of material but that's just "bait" to gain the trust of their targets, and it's corrupted by their leaven.

To really teach their program they have to add to the Bible with their junk like Pearl of Great Price, Book of Mormon, weird traditions and whatever their elders come up with next. You're right when you say Mormons don't believe the Bible, the KJV shreds Mormonism like a wood chipper that's why old Joe spent so much time trying to destroy it -- oops I mean "restore" it!

_________________
"It is the duty of all Nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favors." -- George Washington (Ref: A Collection, W.B. Allen, ed. 543)


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:39 am 
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Ok, thanks for that.. Yeah, it's kind of like the SDA, either you got to believe the KJV Bible (which conservative SDAs use) or the Bible THROUGH the lense of Ellen White.

The Mormons have a claim that God's church was lost, and it can be believable if you don't know your Bible well. They will say that no church today dates back to the time of the apostles. With that the proper priesthood authority to be baptized was lost as well. How would you guys respond to this claim? The Bible says in Matthew 16:18


"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."



What about the spiritual gifts? Mormons are not exclusive to these, but do you believe they've ceased? Where is the scripture that prove this? I came across 1 Cor. 12 that talks about them being in the church.

How can you refute their argument that God worked by apostles and prophets in the past, the NT church had them, why not in the last days?

_________________
"Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil." – Ephesians 6:11


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:00 pm 
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Soldier4Christ wrote:
What about the spiritual gifts? Mormons are not exclusive to these, but do you believe they've ceased? Where is the scripture that prove this? I came across 1 Cor. 12 that talks about them being in the church.

I Corinthians chapter 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away. 9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. 10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
Quote:
How can you refute their argument that God worked by apostles and prophets in the past, the NT church had them, why not in the last days?

We have the written word.

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1 Peter 1:25
But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 7:51 pm 
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What's with the big lightning rods outside their buildings?

Do they think they can thwart the will of God when He tries to strike them with lightning?


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:57 am 
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Soldier4Christ wrote:
The Mormons have a claim that God's church was lost, and it can be believable if you don't know your Bible well. They will say that no church today dates back to the time of the apostles. With that the proper priesthood authority to be baptized was lost as well. How would you guys respond to this claim? The Bible says in Matthew 16:18
"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."

What about the spiritual gifts? Mormons are not exclusive to these, but do you believe they've ceased? Where is the scripture that prove this? I came across 1 Cor. 12 that talks about them being in the church.
How can you refute their argument that God worked by apostles and prophets in the past, the NT church had them, why not in the last days?


Who cares! These are not weighty matters of the faith, just gateways to their stinking pile of "extra biblical revelation."

Other denominations claim they have "priesthood authority" ( Catholics ) and "apostles and prophets" ( Pentecostals ) and the "gifts" ( Charismatics ) but these really aren't salvation issues they are just distractions and window dressing for their deception.

If you have three apples they might be pretty colors -- red, yellow, green but if they are all rotten on the inside what difference does it make? Cults love to bait people and confuse them with distractions but we don't have to refute every peculiar little tradition their elders dream up! So we stick to the big issues.

The LDS Bible Dictionary says:
"Grace cannot suffice without total effort on the part of the recipient. Hence the explanation, ‘It is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do’ (2 Ne. 25:23)”

The Mormon James Talmage ( so-called "Apostle" ) said:
"Salvation comes to the individual only through obedience," ( Articles of Faith, p. 81 ).

Houston we have a problem -- their "apostles" are liars! :roll:

The 3 biggest problems they have are:

1. Salvation by Grace vs. Works
2. The Nature and Deity of Christ
3. Monotheism ( one God vs many )

These are the big issues. There are many other problems in their doctrine but until they get those three right the other stuff really doesn't matter it's just window dressing!

_________________
"It is the duty of all Nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favors." -- George Washington (Ref: A Collection, W.B. Allen, ed. 543)


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:24 pm 
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Soldier4Christ wrote:
The Mormons have a claim that God's church was lost, and it can be believable if you don't know your Bible well.
Isn't that the problem with most or all of the sects and cults? Even mainstream Protestant denominations are based on the idea that the True Church was swallowed up by Roman Catholicism and therefore needed to be "reformed", resulting in the Reformation and the works of men such as the "Institutes" and "Confessions" and such that seem to be referred to more than the Bible itself in Calvinist circles. But like a TULIP sprouting from a pile of manure these things will pass away, but the Bible will endure.
Quote:
[1Pet 1:24] For all flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of grass. The grass withereth, and the flower thereof falleth away: [1Pet 1:25] But the word of the Lord endureth for ever. And this is the word which by the gospel is preached unto you.
So you're right! We do have the Bible, and it is important to know it well.


Quote:
The other deal is that we know God's word is preserved. The Bible promises it in multiple places, Psalm 12:6-7, the words of Jesus "Heaven and earth shall pass away, my words shall not pass away," Isaiah 40:8, etc. So basically, you have to pick a side. Either parts of the Bible are unreliable or corrupted, and God was unable to preserve His words, and now you need to also believe the Book of Mormon... or Mormons don't believe the Bible and want to direct you to their Scriptures.
The problem for the Mormons is, of course, that their "prophets" and books aren't infallible either, and have even been changed. I once saw a film about witnessing to Mormons that used the test of false prophets in the Books of the Law to show that their prophets can't be considered true prophets because of their writings that had to be corrected, as compared to the Bible which still stands. (Perversely, that film that I don't remember the name of or who put it out, used some modern version, which seemed to me to make it harder to hold to the high ground of an inerrant Bible, and is even more silly if the Mormons use the KJV.)

Quote:
Another thing I found similar to their beliefs to KJV Believer's is their view of the Plan of Salvation. Didn't we discuss we don't immediately goto heaven or hell? Well the Mormons too believe this. They believe we goto Paradise or hell (spirit prison). They also believe, as 1 Peter 3 says, Jesus ministered to those spirits in prison. Can you guys shed some light on this area also?

I'm not sure what you mean by not immediately going to Heaven or Hell, the Bible says to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord for the believer. Maybe you're referring to Paradise and such as in the Rich Man and Lazarus, which may be a little different dispensation?

Anyway, even if Mormons agree on a point or two doesn't mean we're all together in agreement and that they're good solid Christians. When I was teaching Sunday School I was talking about what the Bible says about rewards, such as in 1Corinthians 3:11-15, and I was told by a Bible School grad and Baptist minister in the class that I need to be careful about teaching what the Bible says about rewards in Heaven because the Mormons believe there will be rewards. I of course didn't consult what the Mormons believed, I was just going by what the Bible says. If the Mormons believe murder is bad, I'm not going to teach that it's good.


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:00 pm 
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Quote:
If the Mormons believe murder is bad, I'm not going to teach that it's good.


Apparently, people have been killed for apostasy in the Mormon church.

_________________
"Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil." – Ephesians 6:11


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 3:07 am 
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Soldier4Christ wrote:
Apparently, people have been killed for apostasy in the Mormon church.
That's probably not a sign of a Biblically sound Christian church.


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 6:03 pm 

Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2016 12:24 am
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Abram99 wrote:
Bro. Parrish wrote:
I used to be able to teach them that Jesus is God out of their own Book of Mormon, (that would really freak them out), but I'm rusty now...


Please tell us how you did it![/quote


They claim to use the King James Bible...mention Paul saying 'But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.' Galatians 1:8
Show them how Smith's gospel was 'another' gospel.


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 Post subject: Re: Cult Doctrines: Mormonism
PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 8:13 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2016 8:34 am
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I may be able to help... I have some Mormon resources on the way in the mail. Mormonism, Mama, and Me, and Answers to my Mormon Friends.

_________________
"Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil." – Ephesians 6:11


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